tor

Increasing your Wage

195 posts in this topic

Thanks tor. The other AS has consented to my contracting and I met with the new team (a bit) today. Looks like it's chocks away for contracting.  :)

 

They are sending me on training next week so they are definitely keen. I know nothing about rate negotiations though. Any advice from current contractors would be appreciated. I'm thinking of starting high (~150 p/h) and being prepared to drop. I will also need a pimp. Any advice about negotiations, pimps and whatnot also much appreciated.

 

Have a look around at the rates from consulting companies for specialists of the same type. Factor in about 60% of that going to the individual (and 40% to the company) and you have a pretty good idea I reckon.

 

I would say a 150/hr rate is pretty fair for someone in a specialised skill set with some 10 years experience going direct (all the overhead for the person like super, taxes, no holidays etc add up). Especially if the skill set is measurable in results.

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Thanks tor. The other AS has consented to my contracting and I met with the new team (a bit) today. Looks like it's chocks away for contracting.  :)

 

They are sending me on training next week so they are definitely keen. I know nothing about rate negotiations though. Any advice from current contractors would be appreciated. I'm thinking of starting high (~150 p/h) and being prepared to drop. I will also need a pimp. Any advice about negotiations, pimps and whatnot also much appreciated.

 

Since it is a government department, you will need a pimp with government accreditation. The HR dept. should be able to give you a list (BTW, Greythorn mentioned above is one of them). You should then haggle a rate with the pimp since you got the job and not them.

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I will also need a pimp. Any advice about negotiations, pimps and whatnot also much appreciated.

 

Congratulations and all the best of luck.

With your new freedom from the public service does this mean you will now be less refrained in spouting your opinions on public forums?  :shocking:

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You can download one here: http://www.greythorn.com.au/request-to-download-salary-guide

 

Other recruitment companies may publish similar reports. I like to be upfront with salary expectations (it has cost me opportunities but saved me time), and how much you set as your rate depends on how much you're willing to walk away from the role.

 

Thanks Mr M, the link was very useful. I'm setting 130p/h net as an absolute minimum based on comparative rates. I'm prepared to walk for anything less. 

 

 

Have a look around at the rates from consulting companies for specialists of the same type. Factor in about 60% of that going to the individual (and 40% to the company) and you have a pretty good idea I reckon.

 

I would say a 150/hr rate is pretty fair for someone in a specialised skill set with some 10 years experience going direct (all the overhead for the person like super, taxes, no holidays etc add up). Especially if the skill set is measurable in results.

 

Including all the overheads (the ACT government bleeds an extra 6.87% payroll tax for all contractors) a 130 net is acceptable as that equates to ~150 gross. I know for a fact that IBM are tendering for the same role for much more. 

 

 

Since it is a government department, you will need a pimp with government accreditation. The HR dept. should be able to give you a list (BTW, Greythorn mentioned above is one of them). You should then haggle a rate with the pimp since you got the job and not them.

 

 

I'm considering Hayes. I've been assured they will only skim an extra 5 p/h from conversations. Been told to avoid Clicks. 

 

Thanks all for your sage advice. Much appreciated. I will keep you posted.

 

 

Congratulations and all the best of luck.

With your new freedom from the public service does this mean you will now be less refrained in spouting your opinions on public forums?  :shocking:

 

 

Thanks Ugg. Unfortunately the same censorship applies to contractors as permanents. Worse still they can punt me far more easily as a contractor than they can a permie. General criticism is allowed but if I delve into secret departmental business I will be sacked no doubt. If you look at my posting history a clever person could probably glean which department I now work for.  :yes: Rest assured though if I get sacked then a blood feud will begin.  :o

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I'm considering Hayes. I've been assured they will only skim an extra 5 p/h from conversations. Been told to avoid Clicks. 

 

Thanks all for your sage advice. Much appreciated. I will keep you posted.

 

 

You should be able to ask them how much they're charging for your services. If I recall correctly, as part of their accreditation, they have to tell you when asked.

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You should be able to ask them how much they're charging for your services. If I recall correctly, as part of their accreditation, they have to tell you when asked.

 

Forgot to mention that you should Google for feedback from contractors about the agency you plan to select before you consent to using them. I've heard mixed reviews about Hays in the past.

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Forgot to mention that you should Google for feedback from contractors about the agency you plan to select before you consent to using them. I've heard mixed reviews about Hays in the past.

 

The weird thing is that the guy who will be my boss has been mailing me with suggestions as to the best pimps. This could be construed as concern or vested interest. I'm opting for concern at getting the project over the line. But some faint alarm bell is ringing.

 

Edit: Or me wearing a tinfoil hat at the crossover between public and private...

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You should be able to ask them how much they're charging for your services. If I recall correctly, as part of their accreditation, they have to tell you when asked.

 

I got really drunk in front of a Hayes person 2 weeks ago and it looks like they want me on board as an outside specialist. It must be noted that here not getting drunk is a sign of being insincere though (I do love this country, I can outdrink the vast majority of Australians, drinking with japanese I normally knock off half a bottle of scotch before I go just so it is even).

 

They do seem to take a large amount of stock in "how you are drunk is a good indicator of how are you are when pissed off". Largely I agree with that idea. Just fun that finally there is a culture that tests it based on drinking rather than sitting in management review meetings.

 

I get ranty either way but I have more fun with the drinking test rather than the boredom test.

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The weird thing is that the guy who will be my boss has been mailing me with suggestions as to the best pimps. This could be construed as concern or vested interest. I'm opting for concern at getting the project over the line. But some faint alarm bell is ringing.

 

Edit: Or me wearing a tinfoil hat at the crossover between public and private...

 

Nah once you go bad boy you have to accept some stuff will sh*t and burn and if ii does it will because someone wants it to, you are a contractor so that is just part of the game, hell I have performance recommendations outstanding for 15 years at the moment with one client because the vendor closed shop and no one is brave enough to say "go", platform runs like arse ever day, I mail once a month to remind them.

 

As a manager of that kind of department I would be bringing in contractors with as much goodwill as I could; You got tons of cash because of me? good, ignore the c**ts and do my sh*t as much as possible now.

 

Odds are good he is setting you up to trash someone enough he can fire them though, get ready for that moral dilemma.

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I turned up drunk to my first interview in my current department. It didn't go so well. Upon asking me what integrity meant to me I could only shrug, burp and stage a blank look. Much later on I spoke with the person that had recommended me and they vouchsafed that the interviewer thought I was drunk. I confirmed that I was. It was a policy role so I wasn't much concerned.

 

Happily, a more hands on role availed itself. Even so, the guy that interviewed me still casts a wary eye over me every time I cross his path. I give him a surreptitious wink in reply.

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You know what I'm losing sleep over is the faith that is being placed in my abilities on the recommendation of others. I don't even know the tool I'll be using. Hence the one week of training. I don't doubt that I can work it out but damn the pressure will be on. 

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I always figured get a job based on lower standards you would support. If they hire you drunk they will accept daily drunkeness. I redid an aapt HR poster to that tune a decade ago. All of my editted photocopies got stolen. I think I might have posted it here, certainly intended to. It included "Dancing Hitler". If I didn't I paid a german to scan all my crap before leaving aus. I can try and dig it up.

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You know what I'm losing sleep over is the faith that is being placed in my abilities on the recommendation of others. I don't even know the tool I'll be using. Hence the one week of training. I don't doubt that I can work it out but damn the pressure will be on. 

heh tool :)

 

All things being equal you sh*t and burn or you don't.

 

If you don't you are one of the awesome people and your current salary just became worthless but you have to work out the contract before putting it up.

 

If you do sh*t and burn you just go back to a normal life is all, no biggie.

 

But f*ck me that fun of the first day is awesome isn't it? You need it to kill the job but to me now it always feels like the smell of good coffee when you are in bed. You don't want to get out but when you do that little bit of work you get rewarded with the tasty tasty beverage. And that little bit of pain makes it better than having it brought to you in bed.

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It's a buzz for sure. The only thing that salves my own self doubt is my dealings with other contractors most of whom are fairly ordinary. 

 

The security of the defined benefits super and general safety is now gone. The golden shackles released. How hard can it be?  :o

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Hey BTW thanks. I have a theory on self doubt. I never trust anyone that doesn't admit to it. The trick it seems is to have it and pack it away and use it for self improvement. Self belief and not underselling oneself is what I have learned from you. So thanks.  :)

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That's the thing. Once you accept the lack of security as a reality you realise the others that did it didn't do it because they are particularly amazing... they just saw a simple truth and took a small risk, they got there and went lazy. While the fire is bright in you start making a 5 year plan, otherwise too easy to backslide and become exactly what you were with the same anxieties.

 

Once you realise that skilled labour is one of the few remaining resources in the world not sewn up by rich people you create those skills for yourself and become a rich person.

 

Of course "rich person" changes in definitions once it becomes attainable. It's the "tub of ice cream theory". Get the stuff you want, not the stuff you think rich people are supposed to want.

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If you look at my posting history a clever person could probably glean which department I now work for. :yes: Rest assured though if I get sacked then a blood feud will begin. :o

Which department? Menswear surely Mr Granger.

I am pretty sure a clever person wouldn't know my department from my posts. I'm too cunning. Actually I have returned from Christmas to a promotion without a raise, so not too cunning afterall.

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Consider operating through a foundation if they will accept it. Will cost you $1300-1500 to set up. This is what I intend to do but don't have a current need.

 

www.operateintheprivate.com

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That's the thing. Once you accept the lack of security as a reality you realise the others that did it didn't do it because they are particularly amazing... they just saw a simple truth and took a small risk, they got there and went lazy. While the fire is bright in you start making a 5 year plan, otherwise too easy to backslide and become exactly what you were with the same anxieties.

 

Once you realise that skilled labour is one of the few remaining resources in the world not sewn up by rich people you create those skills for yourself and become a rich person.

 

Of course "rich person" changes in definitions once it becomes attainable. It's the "tub of ice cream theory". Get the stuff you want, not the stuff you think rich people are supposed to want.

 

I completed the course today in the "tool". Turns out they have larger plans for me than a simple tool. It was a familiarity exercise. I'm actually happy about that. Though I have no idea what the plans are. 

 

I put in my bid with the pimp for 130 in my hot little hand. Ex all charges and fees. (So about 150 at least given the ACT government's share of 6.89%, super, insurance and the pimps rate etc) They didn't set the dogs on me so I'm counting that as a positive. Meeting next week over coffee and no doubt they'll try and talk me down from my bid. 

 

I'm about to test whether negotiation is improved when one doesn't need the position due to debt penury and my remaining-debt-free-to-gain-more-power-in-wage-negotiations plan has worked. :)  It will not be definitive but indicative. My original plan (and probably preferred plan) was to resign and visit some peeps in Paris have an extended break. Come back and get a job after that. I don't need the money, though with property prices in Melbourne as it is maybe I do.

 

Regardless, it's a win/win situation for me and I'd like to believe that was communicated to said pimp today. I simply don't care either way.

 

I'll keep you posted.

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Which department? Menswear surely Mr Granger.

I am pretty sure a clever person wouldn't know my department from my posts. I'm too cunning. Actually I have returned from Christmas to a promotion without a raise, so not too cunning afterall.

 

It's an age old public service tradition to reward the competent with more work... You should be proud of the promotion, yet beginning succession planning at your earliest convenience. 

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Consider operating through a foundation if they will accept it. Will cost you $1300-1500 to set up. This is what I intend to do but don't have a current need.

 

www.operateintheprivate.com

 

Thanks Mr M. I have to get the job first.  :)

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OK so an update is due as I have news. Turns out one can't contract to the same department as one is currently working for. ICT contracts are more vigilant than first thought. Also they spotted me in SAP. So the upshot is that I have long service leave until mid July which I will now take and I have been asked to resign during June and reapply for a re-advertised role in mid-July. Things may change of course but it was heartening to hear that the RFQ was deemed as having no suitable applicants and that I get a second shots as they want my mad skillz. Anyhoo off to Europe I go!  :)

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OK so an update is due as I have news. Turns out one can't contract to the same department as one is currently working for. ICT contracts are more vigilant than first thought. Also they spotted me in SAP. So the upshot is that I have long service leave until mid July which I will now take and I have been asked to resign during June and reapply for a re-advertised role in mid-July. Things may change of course but it was heartening to hear that the RFQ was deemed as having no suitable applicants and that I get a second shots as they want my mad skillz. Anyhoo off to Europe I go!  :)

 

Good luck SC. I'm sure you'll land on your feet with more coin in your pocket.

 

As for me - I should start a thread about "Decreasing your wage". I have decided to take a slightly lower paying job in London. It gets me closer to my sons who live there already.

 

At my age, this is kind of a travelling the world while having a local job. It will be fun to discover London. My wife desperately wants to move back to Australia, but we both want to stay close to our kids here for now.

 

The retirement plan is to be able to spend time in both Australia and Europe every year. We just have to work out that little detail of being able to afford housing in two different parts of the world...

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My department has seen fit to invoke national security grounds to suppress industrial action. So the short answer is yes.  :o I will be less refrained. Gloves are off.

 

Edit: clarification

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