Phronesis

Phronesis is out

29 posts in this topic

Hello Elf, Tor and others....

You may recall me from my posts back in the GHPC days.

I have monitored Australia's decline closely over the three years since I departed from your ranks at GHPC. My reason for leaving that forum was that I felt I was spending too much time observing and narrating and not enough time putting a plan into action. Anyway, I have spent the last few years building up an online outsourced labour business. It has grown expotentially and I now enjoy a passive 6 figure income from it.

I have just applied, and been granted a multiple entry 12 month business investment visa for Thailand. I have also sold all of my assets in Australia (right down to my spearguns and antique telephones). In a week or two, I will be flying out to set up camp in my new (5BR 3Bth) beachfront bungalow (purchased with my SMSF for less than $40KAUD). I will be taking nothing more with me than 12 laptops, a Nikon D90, the clothes on my back, and an array of fixed interest online accounts.

I have grow very...VERY...tired of government corruption, apathy and financial mismanagement in this country. I loved the setting and climate of my old home (Cotton Tree) on Queenslands sunshine coast, but I just cant stomach Australia's moronic socio-polictical fabric any more. As I sit here typing this post....there are twenty or so drunken idiots (wearing Australian flag capes) trying to snap off the street sign in front of my office. I would call the police, but there is little hope of them coming. There are no young girls in the mob or drugs to be seized for resale.

One of my favourite quotes is that of Ghandi: "I have lived my life as a series of experiments in truth".....nice

Well, I am about to embark on my next experiment. I plan on maintaining my online business from a house on an isolated cliff face overlooking the Andaman Sea. My business model is quite simple really. Source high value work from Australia and use cheap labour to process it. Live for a fraction of the costs in Australia and let arbitrage work its magic. I am also excited by my new business in that it alows me to be rather altruistic (not my default setting...but always a fashionable look at dinner parties). The reason why I am taking 12 laptops with me is that I have been slowing training a number of people in my local village to work with me to process the work. I have already trained two girls (who previously were forced to work as sex workers because of their poverty), they now make a weekly wage that is higher than the local doctor who pulls 6 x 12hour shifts each week at the nearest hospital. I will be attempting to expand my workflows...and workfoce...in the year ahead.

If any one is interested, I will maintain this topic with a periodic reflection upon my progress and whether my newly planned life is meeting with my (and my workers) expectations.

Let it be noted I was the first rat to leave the sinking ship...

Kind Regards to you all

P.S. Elf....did you ever sell that house in S.A. you were trying to flog to everyone on GHPC

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Damn. I am impressed. I wouldn't like the temporary visa. By the age of 23 I was tired of temporary visas and by the age of 32 I was tired of permanent visas.

I either don't have the balls or my frustration level hasn't reached the stage to do this (yet). I don't have the innovative idea to pursue either besides consulting in my field. I have lived in three countries but they were largely riskless moves. The problem is my total wealth rises about 2% per month on extremely low living costs which makes it quite hard to find something more financially rewarding. The downside is my life isn't non-financially rewarding. My flatmate commented on my lifestyle the other day "More gold on the coffin, more gold on the coffin..." which I guess means I'd have to take a cut in financial rewards to improve my personal satisfaction.

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There should be an Australia Day award for people like you Phronesis. I'm damn proud of you. All the best and let us know how it works out. :-)

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Some photos of the new place would be nice too!

+1

Good show.

As I sit here typing this post....there are twenty or so drunken idiots (wearing Australian flag capes) trying to snap off the street sign in front of my office. I would call the police, but there is little hope of them coming. There are no young girls in the mob or drugs to be seized for resale.

Ask them how a Royal Navy Captain hoisting a British flag in Sydney cove 223 years ago (8 days after arriving in Australia)stimulates such behaviour? Some sort of symbolic antithesis?
I have grow very...VERY...tired of government corruption, apathy and financial mismanagement in this country. I loved the setting and climate of my old home (Cotton Tree) on Queenslands sunshine coast, but I just cant stomach Australia's moronic socio-polictical fabric any more.
Spot on. Please keep this thread updated.

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Sounds like you did better than me, 6 figure passive is impressive. Congrats. I am guessing though that your definition of passive is somewhat different to most peoples - working 5 hrs a day instead of 18 only feels passive :)

Also sounds like you are using it to help others (while helping yourself but that is sensible). Much respect.

I think I might be very interested in what you are doing, I often have a need to outsource work because I just can't do it all. Can you PM some more detail on what you are doing? See if there is a link there.

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Sounds like you did better than me, 6 figure passive is impressive. Congrats. I am guessing though that your definition of passive is somewhat different to most peoples - working 5 hrs a day instead of 18 only feels passive :)

Also sounds like you are using it to help others (while helping yourself but that is sensible). Much respect.

I think I might be very interested in what you are doing, I often have a need to outsource work because I just can't do it all. Can you PM some more detail on what you are doing? See if there is a link there.

Tor

I recall that you build and maintain databases. My business is not in that area. You are a bright man so I have no doubt that you will be able to source your own offshore labour at competitive prices to help you with your overflow. Or fly in a train some as I have done.

You were right to pull me up on my "flagrant" use of the word passive. At present my management contribution consists for managing about 20 emails per week and making montlhly wage transfers. There will be nothing passive about my first year in Thailand however, as I intend to expand my catchment out of just Australia and in to other English speaking countries. I also need to set up my new business accounts in Thailand so that I can minimise the chunk that Jooolya takes as tax to pay welfare to the many ( and perhaps including some of the idiots that were just vandalising the street sign outside).

My profit margin is exactly 50% on the work that gets done by my girls. I could easily increase that to around 80% by lowering my staffs wages close to the local rates, however I am very satisfied by a 50/50 split. One of my girls has just built her mother a new house with some of her savings. She (the mother) previously lived in a corrugated iron and timber "humpy". She now has a rather nice brick bungalow, with an inside toilet. As a result, the mother (long since a widower) has recent had a proposal from a man in the village and now has a new husband. My worker is now planning to save up to buy a small tractor.

Kind Regards

Pronesis

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You were right to pull me up on my "flagrant" use of the word passive. At present my management contribution consists for managing about 20 emails per week and making montlhly wage transfers. There will be nothing passive about my first year in Thailand however, as I intend to expand my catchment out of just Australia and in to other English speaking countries.

In my experience the "first years startup work" never goes away as you learn more and see the failings of your first year so you fix them. Third year you realise you were an absolute buffoon in the second year and go and fix them :)

My profit margin is exactly 50% on the work that gets done by my girls. I could easily increase that to around 80% by lowering my staffs wages close to the local rates, however I am very satisfied by a 50/50 split. One of my girls has just built her mother a new house with some of her savings. She (the mother) previously lived in a corrugated iron and timber "humpy". She now has a rather nice brick bungalow, with an inside toilet. As a result, the mother (long since a widower) has recent had a proposal from a man in the village and now has a new husband. My worker is now planning to save up to buy a small tractor.

Makes sense. Always pay above market rate if you can. Some people say this means you attract the best. I call bollocks on that and say that when you pay above market rates you can feel okay in your heart for firing someone when they don't perform because above market rates is a clear indication that the "we work hard" statement in the interview was not bollocks.

All things being equal hiring people is good for society and the reason businesses get tax breaks is because we do that. Moving to another country to do it is not required by my business plan so I can afford to hire locals. Sounds like your business plan being hit by our tax rates has had a benefit to Thailand though. Helping people is generally good regardless of nationality. If your business wouldn't have stood up here then doing it there is probably a good thing for the world as a whole.

Try and learn to speak Thai if you have time, very interesting language. My mum speaks it and has explained some bits of it to me.

I don't believe any of the people I pay are saving for a tractor though.

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I was working today tidying up my house in preparation for my imminent departure. As I toiled away my mind wandered from the menial tasks at hand to reflect upon some of my motivators for leaving Australia. One that stood out was the all consuming BLANDNESS that has slowly engulfed Australia's cultural fabric. In my mind's eye, this invasion of homogenisation started to ramp up shortly after the election of Howard and has continued like a poisionous weed ever since. Perhaps in one hundred, or one thousand years, anthropologists will identify the airing of OPRAH in Australia as the exact moment when all Antipodean cultural uniqueness died.

I am tired...VERY tired...of attending any sort of gather or function in Australia nowadays...because...with never failing predictability the conversion will lead to property purchase or renovation.

Good Lord Australia...you have become SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO damn boring.

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I was working today tidying up my house in preparation for my imminent departure. As I toiled away my mind wandered from the menial tasks at hand to reflect upon some of my motivators for leaving Australia. One that stood out was the all consuming BLANDNESS that has slowly engulfed Australia's cultural fabric. In my mind's eye, this invasion of homogenisation started to ramp up shortly after the election of Howard and has continued like a poisionous weed ever since. Perhaps in one hundred, or one thousand years, anthropologists will identify the airing of OPRAH in Australia as the exact moment when all Antipodean cultural uniqueness died.

I am tired...VERY tired...of attending any sort of gather or function in Australia nowadays...because...with never failing predictability the conversion will lead to property purchase or renovation.

Good Lord Australia...you have become SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO damn boring.

Heads up buddy. All countries are boring or deadly.

You are headed for thailand where thing either exciting (death to the protesters, I was sold into sexual slavery etc) or boring (much the same as here with slightly different food).

I know which one I will choose.

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In a week or two, I will be flying out to set up camp in my new (5BR 3Bth) beachfront bungalow (purchased with my SMSF for less than $40KAUD). I

Interesting

I too would like photo's of this build

Others in Thailand cant manage to get smaller houses built for under

3,000,000baht ($100,000aud) using basic stuff, real cost farang style would be double or more.

http://teakdoor.com/...tml#post1648130

Thai_house_plans_large_3_bed_with_study_3.jpg

Heres a thread for this house being built right now

Nowhere near the water

and it's likely to cost him $114,000 aud PLUS, with no mention of initial land purchase

http://teakdoor.com/...-chap-udon.html

Edited by Frank Castle

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How did you IP's fare during the floods Frank?

Fine thanks

Most never see water

the ones that do, the worst had 7 steps above the flood peak so thats around 1225mm before it hits the floorboards

All powerpoints, powerboards and services are above Q100 level so no damage at all

tenants reported no problems and didnt require any assistance in cleanup on my part (I asked) and had it all well under control when my PM visited

Added bonus is the lovely layer of rich silt in the yards

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and it's likely to cost him $114,000 aud PLUS, with no mention of initial land purchase

I reckon the house is a steal including those two sports cars.

Edited by sydney3000

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Interesting

I too would like photo's of this build

Others in Thailand cant manage to get smaller houses built for under

Thai_house_plans_large_3_bed_with_study_3.jpg

Heres a thread for this house being built right now

Nowhere near the water

and it's likely to cost him $114,000 aud PLUS, with no mention of initial land purchase

http://teakdoor.com/...-chap-udon.html

Well. I can see there is still a good deal of didactic poison from those unwilling to accept there other ways to have a interesting and fullfilling life. Same stuff I endured on GHPC. So after this post I will bid you all well and leave you be.

For the record, obesse, flacid and love struck sex tourists build there thai girlfriends 100K plus houses and leave them in their girl's name.

Others, choose to buy foreclosed properties direct from thai bank's, sometimes at 70% below market value, and take full title into an appropriately structured entity. Often the foreclosed properties are those stolen from love struck sex tourists by the former GF after the infidelity and subsequent split, and after she has remortgage with the bank and failed to make any repayments. Usually the remortgage is to buy some stupid consumer item such as a car, or to try to bail out the (already heavily indebted family and family farm).

Here is just one of the many thai bank foreclosure websites:

http://propertyforsale.kasikornbank.com/PropertyForSaleSearchInput/1,1011,-EN-,00.html?promotion=all

For those of you who continue to hold SE QLD realestate, at best you will have to endure a few years of treading water. At worst you will loose significant amounts. For those of you who still own Sunshine Coast property (residential or commercial), purchased within the last 7 years...you are already screwed big time. Listings are now popping at 30 percent discounts (with the agents actually stating the previous sales price against the current asking price). But still there is nigh a contracted listing to be found. Things will only deteriorate as stock builds up moving in to winter...it is a seasonal market up here. Vendors list heading in to the Christmas period, to sell to the baby boomer greater fools up on holidays from the southern states. BUT...none arrived this year. There is wholesale carnage as small business shop fronts...and some larger franchises, such as Dick Smith are going bust one after another. Unleased commercial property outnumbers leased property by at least 2 to 1. Rents are going down...not up. If you dont believe me click on the rent tab for realestate.com.au for some maroochydore and its surrounds and have a look at the (thousands of listings). Tradies have left...no work. Tourists just didn't arrive (not just because of the rain, but also I because you can now fly into Phuket for $299. Why on earth would you pay $300 per night, or more, for a sh*tbox family holiday unit overlooking a Mcdonalds at Mooloolaba, when you can rent a FIVE STAR room in asia for less than a third of that money?)....AND the international students out at the uni also didn't arrive in January. If you own something on the Sunny Coast...SELL NOW...(if you can)...unless of course your business model needs a reliable 10 to 15 year loss for tax purposes.

Tor

For the record I have lived and worked extensively in Asia for more than 25 years. I no exactly what it is like on the ground where I am headed. I have carefully measured each lifestyle and am now convinced a far better option is to live abroard. I have lived on the sunshine coast for many reasons. But one of the more significant was that I pull work from more expensive cities and mining centers and process it where I can live with a good quality of life at a cheap price. I will continue to pull work from Australia...but I will be reducing my living costs by at least 60 percent. A 600ml bottle of coke at my local store costs four bucks. In Thailand I can buy some barbeque chicken, sticky rice, pork soup and a bottle of coke (with ice) for the same money.

Akin to Henry David Thoreau, I have little talent for wealth. But I do have great flair for living cheaply. I work on a high value projects and have NO fixed costs business model (with a few small exceptions). For me, moving to a new, and cheaper living environment, is both exciting and a bit of a challenge. I welcome the pending experience, and am fully aware it carries risk. I am in the business of risk management and have been for more than two decades...

Kind Regards

Phronesis

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Akin to Henry David Thoreau, I have little talent for wealth.

Like Aristotle, I don't like pants.

Hell I am going to use that in my next job interview; "Aristotle very rarely wore pants; I will mostly look after your databases in the nude ergo you should totally hire me".

Sorry man, you are going way outside rational discussion on this one. I am happy to continue, most of my best stories are ones from talking to way crazy people.

The good thing though is that you start this kind of crazy talk now and Frank turns up after months of absence. He has experience on the ground there I believe. You should probably PM him and make sure you are not being taken for a ride.

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Like Aristotle, I don't like pants.

Hell I am going to use that in my next job interview; "Aristotle very rarely wore pants; I will mostly look after your databases in the nude ergo you should totally hire me".

Sorry man, you are going way outside rational discussion on this one. I am happy to continue, most of my best stories are ones from talking to way crazy people.

The good thing though is that you start this kind of crazy talk now and Frank turns up after months of absence. He has experience on the ground there I believe. You should probably PM him and make sure you are not being taken for a ride.

Have you, Tor, analysed PH's theory?

Reported back?

If not why waffle?

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Well. I can see there is still a good deal of didactic poison from those unwilling to accept there other ways to have a interesting and fullfilling life.

Oh I can accept the way of life just fine

I have been actively searching out places myself in Vietnam , Thailand , Malaysia , Philippines and Borneo for many years now

For the record, obesse, flacid and love struck sex tourists build there thai girlfriends 100K plus houses

Thats a terrible way of describing people

Are you sure they are all like that?

and leave them in their girl's name.

Well farang cant own Thai property so its usually either the Thai bride, the thai business(with 40% ownership to the farang) or a 2x30 (year lease)

Others, choose to buy foreclosed properties direct from thai bank's, sometimes at 70% below market value, and take full title into an appropriately structured entity. Often the foreclosed properties are those stolen from love struck sex tourists by the former GF after the infidelity and subsequent split, and after she has remortgage with the bank and failed to make any repayments. Usually the remortgage is to buy some stupid consumer item such as a car, or to try to bail out the (already heavily indebted family and family farm).

Here is just one of the many thai bank foreclosure websites:

http://propertyforsa...l?promotion=all

And fair enough

I to have looked at sites like this also

This one you linked to has many properties but seeing as you said $40,000 aud was the number, lets have a look

As my Thai is not that good I have used the english site and it makes things more transparent for lookers here

Now, I couldnt find anything on the water as most of the provinces listed are well inland, but you would get better bang for buck being well away from the water and touristy areas

There was this one here for $38,000

http://propertyforsa...042-TH-,00.html

One-story houses, buildings, parking, age 5 years.

Not quite the 5 bedroom with cliff top Andaman sea view is it.

IMG-V-02-88-05042.jpg

Then there's this one here for a bit more than $40k

One-story home on 2 rear, single storey workshop building, swimming pool and garage buildings aged 16 years.

It's $54,000 and still no cliff-top Andaman sea view

http://propertyforsa...148-TH-,00.html

IMG-V-02-88-03148.jpg

But we get closer to the water with this one at Krabi

http://propertyforsa...992-TH-,00.html

And, it would possibly have 5 bedrooms and 3 bathrooms as well being a semi detached (duplex) 3 story

But alas, still no where near the water, but at least it looks livable in comparison to the $40k examples

Especially for someone who turns their nose up at 3 star Australia and deserves 5 star Thailand, though I doubt this even gets close.

The price you ask?............$123,500

Thats a long way from $40k isnt it

IMG-V-02-88-04992.jpg

Perhaps you should be providing an actual link and photo's to something similar to this Andaman sea 5 bedroom stunner you claim to have acquired for $40k

Because I am hard pressed finding much more than studio apartments and small 1 bedders with water views for that price

Even when using the website you provided

.

Why on earth would you pay $300 per night, or more, for a sh*tbox family holiday unit overlooking a Mcdonalds at Mooloolaba, when you can rent a FIVE STAR room in asia for less than a third of that money?)

Indeed, why would you

When you could rent my current favourite up there with fantastic water views for about $140

maroochydore-accommodation17.jpgmaroochydore-accommodation7.jpg

http://www.northclif...ommodation.html

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This has become a totally weird thread.

I'm struggling to follow the logic and the plot.

Where did Frank come from?

Who is Phronesis?

Why is tor antagonistic?

If someone believes that a better life awaits in Thailand, so be it.

I don't know if it is, but then I'm not going there.

Sorry, I feel like I missed something.

:o:blink:

Edited by Solomon

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That's the one that keeps me lying awake at night.

hahaha, you lead a blessed life if that is the only thing keeping you up at night...

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Perhaps you should be providing an actual link and photo's to something similar to this Andaman sea 5 bedroom stunner you claim to have acquired for $40k

Because I am hard pressed finding much more than studio apartments and small 1 bedders with water views for that price

Even when using the website you provided

And your fabulous Rockhampton properties are where?

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And your fabulous Rockhampton properties are where?

In Rockhampton

You will notice I only asked for

an actual link and photo's to something similar to ...
not the actual property

So in keeping with that I can do the same.

I have older properties in Rockhampton close to and similar to these

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-qld-wandal-404911887

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-qld-west+rockhampton-403573004

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-qld-the+range-404988130

There are no listings for newer 3 bedroom places so I cant provide anything similar........sorry

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That's the one that keeps me lying awake at night.

yu should sleep like a baby. waking up every 10 mins.... claw you could move Lock-lea ?

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Have you, Tor, analysed PH's theory?

Reported back?

If not why waffle?

Which theory?

My mum lived in Thailand for years. Phronesis has gone from what sounded like a slightly exaggerated story

  • 6 figure passive income
  • SMSF investing in a house for him to live in
  • Thai corruption less than Australian
  • Thai internet infrastructure being suitable to run an online business (although I haven't been there in about 10 years so this might have changed)

to one that I find exceedingly hard to believe.

And hasn't answered any questions.

Then tells me he pays 4$ for a 600mk coke and has a flair for living cheaply. At a time I am tired. I started a rebuttal of his post but the comparison to Thoreau and the sudden increase in spelling mistakes made me start giggling at how badly I was being trolled so I just made fun of him instead.

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